Cast shooter upgrade

[madsenshooter]

I was trolling ebay last week and noticed a Litschert Targeteer scope booster. It was a 12x and the lady told me it had a K6 stamped down near the bottom. I wound up with the thing for what I think was a pretty good buy. Received it, and it wouldn't fit my K6. Turns out the adaptor coupling that came with it will only work on the 48 and 49 models of the K6. I had to make a .024 thick threaded inside and out ring in order to make it work with my scope. It's still a lot of scope for a Krag, but might be how some 1950s varmint hunter may have done his one and only rifle then. Maybe some young guy from Pennsylvania, a contemporary of Bob Bell, who used his Krag for chucks in the summer then back to 6x for deer out of the orchard in the fall and winter. Scope, booster and mount, a Miller Kodiak Dreamount, are all from the early 1950s.

I had to press the lens from an old Weaver KV out of it's brass seat using my reloading press. I don't know what the glue was Weaver used back then, but it took a lot of force. Despite that force, no harm whatsoever to the lens. That brass ring provided the male thread that I needed for my adaptor ring.

[Pentz]

Wow! That is quite an impressive setup! How will the mass of that forward lens react under recoil?

[jon_norstog]

Lot of scope on that gun! Let's see some targets!

jn

[madsenshooter]

Wow! That is quite an impressive setup! How will the mass of that forward lens react under recoil?

There's enough spring tension on the thing to keep it from rocking in recoil. I found an Unertl lens out there, or I'm assuming to be so since it has JU on the edge. Yes targets are in order, sometime this coming week. It appeared to me the Litschert had never been used. One scratch in the bluing that thankfully wound up near the bottom.

[madsenshooter]

I finally got the Litschert solidly installed. I wanted to try an experiment, see how much difference there would be between a cast bullet seated into the rifling and one seated with a .1" jump. Load was 32.3gr of Russian 4895 behind the NOE 311365. Checked and lubed the bullet weighed 186gr. The smaller group was the one seated into the rifling, and as you can see, the .1" jump nearly doubled the group size. Now that I've seen this for myself, I'll be using the fatter nose version of the bullet at Camp Perry, it's into the the throat when it's below max magazine length. If anyone is wondering why there are fewer shots in the smaller group, it's because it took quite a few rounds to get this contraption on paper!

[jon_norstog]

Madsen,

I can really see the value of a scope for fine-tuning rifle/load combinations. The difference between the two loads would probably been lost in sighting error with iron sights - unless maybe you fired groups of 20 or more.

Good work there!

jn

[madsenshooter]

I figure it's the gas momentarily blowing around the bullet before it starts moving and plugs the bore that makes the difference. Sorta allows the bullet a moment of free float, perhaps shifting around just a tiny bit during that time. Just the primer blast would be enough. My next experiment will be the fat nosed spitzer sized .311 vs .314, if I can even get the .314 to chamber. Remington cases blow out to a neck ID of .315", so there ought to be room, but I don't know the effect of "through the barrel" sizing on accuracy. Cast bullet benchrest shooters sometimes have their chambers cut so there is no neck expansion at all, keeping nearly all the gas behind the bullet. Their groups make mine look huge!

I'm tempted to have the barrel of at least one of my full length rifles drilled and tapped so I can use this mount for load development. It only requires two holes between the existing sight mounting holes. But, I also have a Kraghaus mount, which requires no holes to be drilled and uses a cheap LER scope. 7x is enough for 100yd load development.

[Parashooter]

It's futile to draw any firm conclusions based on so few shots. If you think you've found a good load, fire 10 to 20 shots more as a reality check. If it's still good, you might have something worthwhile.

For example, couple of 100 yard groups from a 6.5 Carcano -


First five. Wow, that's pretty good for a Carcano!


14 more, same load and rifle, next day. Not so hot.

[madsenshooter]

My life's been nothing but futility, so in this case, I'll keep my conclusion that this one variable was the source of the dispersion. Though I respect your opinion very much, these days, I don't hardly have money for gas for the 20mi range trip let alone an endless supply of powder for 10 or 20 shot groups. If I went to 10 or 20, someone would come along and insist it takes at least 30 and that same someone would be drawing conclusions from his five shot group! I'll try one 55 and and one or two 88rd matches before Camp Perry. Unless something happens there to show me the load won't hold it's accuracy for the 35rds at Perry, it's going.

John, same thing happens with a jacketed bullet allowed a jump to the rifling, but the jacket is generally hard enough to help straighten the bullet, unlike a cast bullet. If it starts crooked, it stays crooked through the bore and one can only hope gyroscopic forces straighten it out on its way to the target.

[Pentz]

I too have had those days when a 5-round group falls into 1 MOA or less, only to find that 10 of the same load jumps it out to 2MOA or more. That is why the CBA military matches run 10-round strings. Separates the sheep from the goats, for sure! As an aside, I shot a 1917 Enfield in the modified match last week - that 6x scope sure makes a difference. Got a 97-6 at 100 and 98-1 first time out with the rifle. I gotta find a Krag that's been D&Td.