British Marked Colt M1911A1 Questions

[dave]

"the US has no proof laws, its up to the manufacturer." This was due to the principals this country was founded on. Self relience, no un-necessary goverment interfearence, and you are responsible for your actions! In other words no 'nanny' state. That is all changing now but it seems they have not thought of proof laws to control guns-----yet!

[Johnny P]

It did not matter if a firearm came from a country that did have a gun proof law unless they had a reciprocal proof law with England. If not, the firearm still had to be proofed before it could be sold there. Germany had a gun proof law but they had no agreement with England, and any German made firearm had to be proofed before being sold in England.

[gfguns]

Speaking of German proof law here is a U.S. manufactured Colt 1911A1 s/n 912419 Russian Lend Lease that made its way back to the States via a dealer in Germany in the 90's. Note the darker than normal finish. I was told the Russians put this black looking finish over our green parked finish but why I don't know. It almost looks like an oil or grease was applied and darkened the original parkerizing over time. None of the original detail or markings on the pistol were compromised by the coating and there is absolutely no sign of buffing. Whatever it is it did not take hold on the bright metal where the original parked finish was absent or broken by stamps applied after original finish e.g. Crossed Cannon escutcheon, inspectors mark and staking. The pistol appears to be unissued in like new condition.

[stan4]

For those that might be interested in British marked Commercial pistols, there are some differences (in markings) with the Government Models (and other arms) purchased by the British government through the British Purchasing Commission and the use of the Crown-W mark Inspector's stamp. (See p. 131 of CWC's Commercial book, 2nd Edition.)

[Johnny P]

Great photos of the German proofs and nice pistol. I always thought it was ironic that the modern German proof was virtually identical to the Nazi Army proof used up until the 1939 time period, with just the N added.

[dave]

Great photos of the German proofs and nice pistol. I always thought it was ironic that the modern German proof was virtually identical to the Nazi Army proof used up until the 1939 time period, with just the N added.

Before the Nazi changed the proof to the eagle/swatzica stamp 'on military arms only', the military proof was the Weimer proof with the 'dropped wings', no letter. The commercial proofs were different then the military ones, even during the Nazi period. Look at any KKW or DSM 'training 22 rifle to see what I mean. They are the ones using letters, N meaning nitro, for instense. Some were eagles (no swatsica), some were crowns.
That 'antler proof' is from a particular Geramn proof house, it was used on some WW1 Gew.98's. Can't remember which one, maybe Elm?

[Johnny P]

For those that were confused by my brief explanation of the similarity between the modern German proof and the Nazi era droop eagle proof I apologize. Instead of using with just the N added, for clarity I probably should have said the Nazi Army proof did not have a N.

For those wondering about a Nazi era KK-W, here are the Nazi commercial proofs.

[gfguns]

For those that were confused by my brief explanation of the similarity between the modern German proof and the Nazi era droop eagle proof I apologize. Instead of using with just the N added, for clarity I probably should have said the Nazi Army proof did not have a N.

For those wondering about a Nazi era KK-W, here are the Nazi commercial proofs.

So was the spread wing eagle pictured used with or without letter other than the Nazi era?

[gfguns]

More info on the proof marks
The Stag horn indicates the ULM proof house and the KF is a date code KF = 1995
The date coding system is very simple too. It gets tricky when you start talking about non-proofed products like firearm magazines, but the general rule is thus:

A B C D E F G H I K
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9

[gfguns]

Does anyone else out there have or have seen one of the Russian Lend Lease 1911A1 pistols?