Cartridge to Chamber fit for M-1, M-1A, AR

[barretcreek]

Found the headspace brawl interesting so I decided to start a thread rather than hijack that one.

A) I have a Mannlicher Schoenauer 8x56 which chambers 8x57 Mauser so I just make cases to fit. Same with a 1950 M94 25/35 which backs out the primers a little. Make the brass to fit.

Now to the question. Has anyone used Sheridan Eng cartridge gauges to set their dies for making ammo for Service Rifles? They seem like a nice approach to the problem of getting brass sized correctly.

[lyman]

I have handful of cartridge case gauges,

Dillon, LE Wilson and one by someone I cannot remember for the calibers I load the most, (223/556, 308, 30.06) and use them randomly when reloading,
as in I'll pull a case every not and then and drop it in the gauge after sizing,
and once again after seating,

I don't check every round unless I find a problem,



what litte bit of 303 reloading I have done so far, I just segregate the brass by rifle, just in case

[fguffey]

Barrettcreek,

Found the headspace brawl interesting so I decided to start a thread rather than hijack that one.

I do not know or understand why it has to be that way, it reminds me of an old folk song; the song ends with "And I do not like anyone very much"

The Mannlicher Schoenauer 8x56 has a case body diameter of .463", The 8MM57 case body diameter is .472" and the 30/06 case head lower body diameter is .470". MEANING: The case body/case head of the 8MM57 case body has to be swaged with a swaging die. In the Special Order Catalog from RCBS, they list the trim die and swaging under the number#58238. The cost in 2010 was 224.95.

The swage die reduces the diameter of the case head in two steps, Without an arbor press there is a lot of hammering and banging going on and you never want to forget to lube the case.

I have dies that were mistakes, three of them will size the base of the 8MM57 down to .463", problem, the die wants to keep ever case. When reducing the diameter of the case head I choose to use cases with thin case heads, I have 30/06 cases with a case head thickness of .260", it did not take me long to decide the thick cases heads were a bad choice.

The trim die in the #58238 case forming set if a forming die, the forming die is sued to trim the case to length. The MS case is .040" shorter than the 8MM57.

the length of the chamber from the shoulder to the bolt face is what a few reloaders refer to as 'head space'. If I was involved I would measure the length of your chamber from the shoulder to the bolt face. After determining the length of the chamber I would adjust the forming die to form the case to fit the chamber.

It is about this time the brawl starts.

F. Guffey

[fguffey]

https://sheridanengineering.com/

Found the headspace brawl interesting so I decided to start a thread rather than hijack that one.

You are assuming there are members on this forum that have seen a Sheridan Engineering case gage. I have case gages, I have chamber gages, I have head space gages, the Sheridan gage is an open and or closed case gage. The case gage has been with us for over 80 years, 15 years ago reloaders were calling the case gage 'a drop-in gage'. From the beginning L.E. Wilson suggested using a straight edge, he even went to the trouble to describe a straight edge to the reloading public, he identified the straight edge as a pocket rule. 60 Years later reloaders were still using their thumb nail.

I read the instructions, pulled out my pocket rule and then staring using a feeler gage before and again after; and then I started using modified dial indicators.

Head space Brawl? I want to know the length of the chamber from the datum to the bolt face; I want to know the length of the case from the shoulder/datum to the case head. And then? I want to know the clearance/difference in length between the two. I understand it is cool to know there are clearances, + and -'s and tolerances, it does not help me to know what it could be, I want to know what it is.

F. Guffey

[Sunray]

OP was in April.
"...8x56 which chambers 8x57 Mauser..." The Mauser should not chamber the MS. The Mauser's case head is nearly 10 thou bigger. .463" vs .472". And no amount of sizing will fix that. Nor will anybody's cartridge gauges make any difference.
"...backs out the primers a little..." That can be headspace or excess pressure.

[fguffey]

"...backs out the primers a little..." That can be headspace or excess pressure.

How is it possible to back the primer out 'a little' with excessive pressure? And then there is excessive clearance; why wouldn't excessive clearance cause the primer to back out?

F. Guffey

[fguffey]

Dillon, LE Wilson and one by someone I cannot remember for the calibers I load the most, (223/556, 308, 30.06) and use them randomly when reloading,
as in I'll pull a case every not and then and drop it in the gauge after sizing,
and once again after seating,

"every not and then etc." I would start by measuring after firing and again after sizing.

F. Guffey