Captured (or "obtained") Spanish Mauser carbine from Cuba

[jon_norstog]

Apparently, Cuban militia who took the part of the Spanish government rather than that of the rebels, were armed with Remington Rolling Blocks in 11mm and/or 11mm reformado. I doubt if the American troops faced them in battle, but maybe...

Well if they didn't face them in Cuba they sure did in the Philippines.

jn

[butlersrangers]

The late John Wall, on the 'gunboards forum', researched and edited The Army Ordnance Department reports of Spanish Mauser sales. (The Ord. Dept. produced a final inventory, dated 26 January,1904, when the last of the Mausers had been sold).

John made a correction to his earlier posting, a list (by 'model') of the Mauser rifles and carbines held by the O.D. at the Armory for sale: " ... The Argentine pattern carbines in this list have different and updated figures: 187 arrived by rail at the Armory in late 1898. 26 were sold during the two-day auction in January, 1899. The remainder were purchased by Francis Bannerman."

(My observation - 'Argentine pattern' was used by U.S. Ordnance to describe the model 1891 Spanish Mauser carbines in 7.65X53mm. There are some Spanish model 1891 carbines and rifles that have no Crest and the Argentine marking on the left receiver wall.

Argentine Pattern Rifles, numbering 1,999, and Turkish [?] Pattern Rifles, numbering 104, were priced at $8.25, without bayonet. Argentine Pattern Carbines, numbering 154 [later increased to 187], were priced at $8.25).

(Additional observation - Spanish Pattern rifles, numbering 7,207, caliber 7mm, with bayonet [model 1893 rifles], were priced at $9.00. Spanish Carbines, numbering 425, caliber 7mm [model 1893 carbines], were priced at $8.25).

Note - "The prices were for arms in lots of not less than 10. If less than 10 arms are desired the price will be 25% higher ...."

[butlersrangers]

BTW - I could not help but notice the 'crescent moon', on the bolt-shroud of the Spanish model 1891 carbine, in the photo that Rick posted. It appears this is very common on the captured Spanish carbines. Some 'overrun' small parts were utilized from the Turkish Mauser contract.

[11mm]

BTW - I could not help but notice the 'crescent moon', on the bolt-shroud of the Spanish model 1891 carbine, in the photo that Rick posted. It appears this is very common on the captured Spanish carbines. Some 'overrun' small parts were utilized from the Turkish Mauser contract.

According to Webster, the "half moon" which he shows as a sketch, was a standard Argentine acceptance mark. I would not think a half moon as shown is a definitive Turkish mark, though it may actually have been used on Turkish contract rifles. Loewe seems to have used a number of distinctive marks which may have no specific reference to a national contract.Not to say they did not use over-run parts...

[butlersrangers]

'11mm' - These 'Spanish Captures' are quite fascinating!

[PhillipM]

Netflix just released a multi episode series, Cuba Libre describing Cuba's history. On a tangent, some of the archival footage shows 1903 Springfields. How did they get to Cuba?

[Rick the Librarian]

The United States occupied Cuba off and on through abut 1912.

[11mm]

BTW - I could not help but notice the 'crescent moon', on the bolt-shroud of the Spanish model 1891 carbine, in the photo that Rick posted. It appears this is very common on the captured Spanish carbines. Some 'overrun' small parts were utilized from the Turkish Mauser contract.

I have since checked some 1891 Argentine Mausers I have, as well as two 1893 Spanish, and one 1893 Turkish. The half moon appears on the Turkish model near that spot, and does not appear on the others. My 1891 Spanish carbine is not here, so I don't have it to check. However, your suspicion is right. The one shown in the original post probably has at least that one surplus Turkish part.

[butlersrangers]

Are the "flaming bomb" marked parts to denote Spanish contract parts?
RTL.jpg

[11mm]

Are the "flaming bomb" marked parts to denote Spanish contract parts?
RTL.jpg

I'll look at my rifles after I get back from where I am for Christmas.