Brass Problem

[JOHN COOK]

Attempting to size 30.06 down to .270 and finally 25.06. I have done this since 1968 prior to Remington going commercial with the 25.06 and never had a problem. I have some 2-3- year old rounds that don't show this problem. (I own a custom built 25.06 built on a 98 Mauser)

All the 30.06 has been cleaned, annealed , re-sized to 30.06 specs. I then proceed to the .270 die and this is where the problem shows up. The neck of the cartridge is reduced to .270 caliber,as it should, but at the point where the cartridge should start a slope upward (not quite to the datum line) I am getting a small belt or bulge. It appears to be about 1/64 of an inch (perhaps I could measure it.) wide. I can actually feel and see it. In looking at the the cartridge it appears it is not going completely all the way up in the .270 die. I am using a Lyman Press which I used for 30 years (no problems) The ram goes up and cams over, I have always done it this way. I loaded 150 rounds of .270 three months ago and had no problem. I also loaded 200 rounds of 30.06 for my 03A3, no problems.

I am using 1950 - 1960 LC brass and some commercial R & P brass and a few Winchester .270 new brass just run of the mill brass. I have broke down each die and made sure they were clean (I use case wax for lube) no wax build up, no nothing. I am using RCBS case holder. It makes no difference which brass I use I get the same results. Thought about using a thinner case holder ( thinking the case may advance further into the .270 die). The thought evened crossed my mind to have a local machine shop remove a couple 1/1000 off the end of the die. I don't know if that would help the cartridge advance further before it cammed over or not. . Dies are all RCBS.

SOMETHING ATTACKED ME!!!!!!!!

I am at a lost why this just started happening. Any ideas or comment would be appreciated. I respectively request we don't get into a PIZZING contest on this..

john in SC

[p246]

So if I'm reading this right you have changed nothing, are using the same equipment, and this problem just rear its head...correct

[p246]

Google or Bing Long Range Hunting 30-06 to 25-06 getting donuts. 3 page thread on the topic. Basically he adjusted his die off the shell holder and the donut went away. Good Luck.

[Cosine26]

John,
I do not know why this just started happening. When I had a 243 Winchester I was making 243 brass out of 7.62 GI LC brass. About 95% of the time it worked OK; but occasionally I would get a case that came out as described. Of course I was using only one resize as I went directly from 7.62 to 243. I never solved the problem but since I have a practically unlimited supply of 7.62 brass, I just ignored the problem and threw away the distorted cases. The other cases worked just fine. Guess that does not help much.
FWIW

[Sunray]

"...getting a small belt or bulge..." Sizer die has loosen and moved down. How is anybody's guess.

[Mickey Christian]

Are the brass trimmed to proper length? Not too long?

[JOHN COOK]

I'm pressed for time at the moment, will answer questions this evening, thanks, I'm going to skip .270 die some one e mailed me and said they resize in 30:06 and go straight to 25:06.??? I stated all were RCBS, mistake, .270 is an old PACIFIC (circa 1950s).

john

[JOHN COOK]

Answers to Questions:
p246: No changes to set up...

Sunray: Die has not moved, it is down as far as it will go, moved die up and "donut" forms about 3/4 of neck. I think the case needs to go further into the die..

Mickey : cases have been trimmed and sized Spec: calls for 2.494 I trimmed to 2.488 (per LYMAN)

I annealed 6 cases of different make and year (year pertaining to LC brass) sized them and trimmed. Ran them through 30:06 die, no expander button, skipped the .270 die and went directly to the 25:06 and it apparently solved the problem. I can see a point where it seems to be trying to form the "donut" but I can't feel it or measure any difference. I immediately selected 3 more cases and followed same procedure, except I ran them through the .270 die prior going to 25:06 die. HELLO, there the "donut" appeared before going to the 25:06 die. I guess this is my problem. I don't know why this happens because I have always used the .270 and then went to 25:06. I stated I had loaded some .270 awhile back but failed to say I used once fired .270 cases, no problems.

Thanks for the input. I'll try some more this PM and see what happens.

john in SC

[fguffey]

All the 30.06 has been cleaned, annealed , re-sized to 30.06 specs. I then proceed to the .270 die and this is where the problem shows up. The neck of the cartridge is reduced to .270 caliber,as it should, but at the point where the cartridge should start a slope upward (not quite to the datum line) I am getting a small belt or bulge. It appears to be about 1/64 of an inch (perhaps I could measure it.) wide. I can actually feel and see it. In looking at the the cartridge it appears it is not going completely all the way up in the .270 die. I am using a Lyman Press which I used for 30 years (no problems) The ram goes up and cams over, I have always done it this way. I loaded 150 rounds of .270 three months ago and had no problem. I also loaded 200 rounds of 30.06 for my 03A3, no problems.

john in SC

Going from 30/06 to 25/06 is a matter of necking the 30/06 case down, it is not a case forming operation. Part of the 30/06 shoulder becomes part of the 25/06 neck. As always there can be artifacts of the parent case that can be seen and or felt. The datum for all three cases is .375" or 3/8". When sizing a 30/06, 270 or 25/06 the die should make it to the shell holder. It is possible to increases the presses ability to overcome the cases ability to resist singing by grinding the top of the shell holder or bottom of the die; I don't, I have never found it necessary.

There are times the case wins, other times the press wins.

F. Guffey

[fguffey]

Brass too long: When necking a case down the case increases in length, some believe the neck gets thicker and or thinner. The 270 Winchester case is .041" longer than the 30/06 and 25/06.

F. Guffey