Trapdoors in gunstores?

[Stephan]

Around my area(Oklahoma) it's not unusual to see a Trapdoor rifle or two on the gunstore used rack...maybe a rolling-block Remington on occasion.

Anyhow..almost invariably the old trapdoors will be rusted and still rusting...bore looking dry corroded and awful...no sign of oil or being cleaned for decades! This doesn't seem to be a phenomenon just limited to a few gunstores, but a wide-spread deal.

I could understand a consignment gun being sold 'as is'...gunstore employees not wanting to clean somebody else's musket they brought in dirty and rusty...however you would think it a simple matter to screw-on an extra section of cleaning rod(to get through 32.5" of bore) and clean the bore...maybe even wipe-down the exterior rust with an oily rag!

I know antique arms enjoy a differing set of grading where bore condition is less a concern than originality of parts and finish...but really?...Rust is bad!

So is this a common deal in other states too...and just what is the mindset of gunstore owners that let cool old antiques just rot-down on the rack??

[Dick Hosmer]

I totally agree with you, but am somewhat envious of your potential opportunities; have not seen a trapdoor in any gun store around here for a long, long time.

[Major Tom]

I concour with Stephan. Even online sales will show photos of rat a$$ed dirty firearms. With a little cleaning the value and eye appeal would increase greatly. Somebody is just too lazy to do it I guess.
The last trapdoor I saw in a gunshop was brutally "customized" by bubba having a parkerized finish on all metal. Other wise it was an early rifle done wrong!

[Stephan]

They always want $750/$850 for the rusty used rack Springfield 1873 rifles.....these just set on the rack for years and years.

I did see a rarity just a few weeks back...a Trapdoor carbine! About never see these in a store. The carbine was fairly clean and nice too...but they wanted $3500 for it(not that clean and not 'Custer era')

[psteinmayer]

I see them occasionally in Cabelas "Gun Library." Sometimes they're nice and priced right. Most times, they are hopelessly OVER priced, and look like something the cat dragged in! I looked at a Krag recently and the bore looked like it hadn't been cleaned since the Boxer Rebellion... like 50 miles of bad road!!!

The interesting thing is... sometimes, all they need is a little cleaning and a little love.

[Stephan]

I see them occasionally in Cabelas "Gun Library." Sometimes they're nice and priced right. Most times, they are hopelessly OVER priced, and look like something the cat dragged in! I looked at a Krag recently and the bore looked like it hadn't been cleaned since the Boxer Rebellion... like 50 miles of bad road!!!

The interesting thing is... sometimes, all they need is a little cleaning and a little love.

Yeh...My Trapdoor rifle was a dirty relic that I bought locally(not a gunstore)...it had been an attorney's decorator and upon his death had been badly stored(boiler room..then closet after it got rusty in the boiler room!). Cleaned-up quite decent as far as bore and mechanics go...wood is ok too. I suppose it was/is quite similar condition as the several Trapdoor rifles I've seen in the stores lately. Mine shoots great...however I paid like $250 for it and sweated bullets until I cleaned the bore and saw it was ok. I wouldn't want to pay $850 bucks for another one only to clean the bore and discover it's the sewer-pipe it looks like!!

My newly acquired Trapdoor carbine is cleaner than I'm used to seeing...however I bought it online out of New York state....but it's a project too and another story....

[dave]

I collect WW11 and early Mausers mainly, but also older 22 rifles. There is a large crowd with the military arms group that thing cleaning ruins the "originality" of the gun. I have posted that no military in the world (old China excepted perhaps) that would tolerate a rusty dirty gun so cleaning rust and crap off will not hurt value but improve it. They show original in the white butt plates which are covered in rust but will not clean them!

[Dick Hosmer]

There's cleaning and there's cleaning. I prefer to do my own. No one wants active rust, and I'll scrub the p--s out of a bore, but I've seen more than enough of what some stupid a-hole (NOT intended to mean you!!) can do with Naval Jelly or a wire wheel, or sandpaper, to the outside of a specimen. Yes, you are right - while in active service no one would tolerate a dirty gun - but - we are not talking about active service, and I have no problem with something that is 150 years old looking like it is 150 years old. As far as cleaning "improving" value, I suspect you'll catch some (more) flack on that - it all depends on how such cleaning is accomplished, and how far it goes.

[psteinmayer]

My 1873 carbine (I've posted pics here a couple years ago) has hung on my dad's mantle for around 50 years now. I took it down a couple years ago to assess and clean, only to discover that hanging over a fireplace has left it with some rust in the action and bore. I worked hard to remove most of the rust, cleaned and oiled the hell out of it, replaced the broken extractor with one from Al F., and placed it back on the mantle (where it stays until my dad passes and I get it in the will). The Bannerman rifle that sits there over it is in better shape corrosion wise... but I did the same to it too!

I plan to shoot both when I take possession of them.

[Bergerboy]

I agree with Dave, although not particularly with the crowd of collectors he references.
I often see comments from Mauser WW1 and WW2 collectors that seem to "salivate" over weapons covered in original closet lint or barn dust that may have accumulated over the years.
There are those that would much prefer to encounter and and/or acquire one of these "buried treasures" in its as-found condition, dust and rust and all. And then relish the opportunitity to do the cleaning themselves, as if they are more connected to it by revealing its original beauty for the first time in X years.

I collect WW11 and early Mausers mainly, but also older 22 rifles. There is a large crowd with the military arms group that thing cleaning ruins the "originality" of the gun. I have posted that no military in the world (old China excepted perhaps) that would tolerate a rusty dirty gun so cleaning rust and crap off will not hurt value but improve it. They show original in the white butt plates which are covered in rust but will not clean them!