Any Thoughts on Professionally "Restored" WWI Handguns?

[colt thompson]

My first "old" 1911 was Turnbull restored 4 digit Navy. I still have it and it's my least favorite.
I'd rather have a pistol that is factory original in the condition I can afford.
Regarding value, I paid about $1500 for the Navy.

[Johnny P]

The 1911 restorations rarely sell for what the restoration cost. In the heat of the moment a restoration may have sounded plausible, but they rarely affect the buying public that way.

[Scott Gahimer]

The only way I can understand having a restoration done is if you have a butt-ugly old pistol that has been permanently altered, has no collector value and no appeal...even as a shooter. Then, I might understand why someone would restore. Breathing some new life into an old, tired dog for the right reasons is an honorable thing to do. Making repairs and restoring finish isn't a bad thing in itself. But one must have all the correct parts to begin with, or I'd never consider a restoration. I'd flat tell the restorer to only use the parts I furnished, too. I'd require some form of accountability on that issue, too.

Buying a gun that's been restored without absolutely knowing all the parts were original, or at least authentic and correct, is a major mistake, IMO. Far too many pistols are humped up with incorrect, and even modern parts, simply because the right parts weren't readily available. That's when a gun is no longer a restoration, but is a fabrication, reproduction, commemorative, clone. The incorrect replacement parts stick out like a sore thumb to anyone who knows what an authentic pistol looks like.

Concerning value, if you value a restoration that you know has authentic, correct parts, as a 0% pistol with issues, then add the actual cost (not retail price) of the work...then I think you're probably pretty close to what most collectors would perhaps pay. And you'd have to have something rare enough to justify a restoration to begin with. If you can go out and find an original pistol without too much trouble, then it would be a loser financially.

Some restorers might furnish before and after photos. But how do you know if those before pictures are of the gun you are considering to purchase? That's why I'd only use my own pistol.

What is a good restoration? IMO, it's something that looks like an original. If it doesn't look like an original piece, well...then it's not a good restoration. I'd never consider a restoration on an early Colt pistol because I've never seen a good restoration on one. No one has managed to master capturing the look. Surface prep and finish just isn't right, when compared to an original. Brushed blue is probably the easiest to replicate, but a lot of guys still don't use the proper tools and methods to get the polish right.

If I were going to send in a pistol for restoration, I personally would only have major parts restored. I'd secure dead original finish and correct small parts to complete the project. Even as obvious as most refinishes are, small parts almost never look right. The less restoration required, the better the job. Knocking the finish off the high edges isn't really too convincing. Blued guns that are 70-100+ years old all have an element of oxidation. When there is no aging in the finish and visible wear patterns, they just don't look original.

I certainly agree with most of the comments here. Restorations don't bring at auction nearly what they sold for "new" from the restoration gunsmith. Don't buy one thinking it is an investment. You'd be better off with 2-3 plain-jane brown wrapper original Remington Rands five years later.

If I want a Ferrari, will I really be satisfied with a VW kit car? No. If you start to fool yourself about what you want, then it's time to back up and rethink things.

[stan4]

Let's say you can afford that original collectible pistol, car, or whatever. And, it is involved in an accident. The "doctors" then repair/restore it. Will you be happy with it?

OTOH, let's say you just want to shoot the hell out of it, drive the hell out of it, or whatever the hell out of it. And, you want it to look "----". Will you be happy with what the "doctors" provide?

Best Regards,

[Wick]

If you start to fool yourself about what you want, then it's time to back up and rethink things.

That's some first-rate advice, right there!

[Scott Gahimer]

Let's say you can afford that original collectible pistol, car, or whatever. And, it is involved in an accident. The "doctors" then repair/restore it. Will you be happy with it?

OTOH, let's say you just want to shoot the hell out of it, drive the hell out of it, or whatever the hell out of it. And, you want it to look "----". Will you be happy with what the "doctors" provide?

Best Regards,

Probably not. That's why I don't shoot my collectible pistols. No need for "doctors". Call it preventative medicine.

[Johnny P]

Collectibles were not all created equal, nor the way they are accepted. The film shown below shows a guy wrecking a vintage Bugatti race car. In 12 to 18 months virtually every piece will have been replaced, and it will probably be worth more than before it was wrecked. If he "drives the hell out of it" and wrecks it again, it can be rebuilt again without losing any value. I suppose a blown up pistol could be hammered, welded, had new markings applied, and finally polished and blued, but who would then want it at it's former value?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uryBzKDkpIc

[jlutin]

Back in 2003 I had wanted a nice 1911 but I could not afford anything decent. I bought a 1917 model with essentially zero finish, but correct parts, from a well-respected collector who often has posted here. I sent it to Bill Adair who restored it. Bill was declining in health at the time and it took about a year for me to get the pistol. I compared his work with high resolution photos from a disc provided by another experienced collector and the grain of the finish and lettering were virtually indistinguishable. His workmanship was impeccable. He died not long after. It is my favorite Colt, although I have others with original finishes. Not only is it a fine example of a 1917 pistol, it reminds me of a skilled craftsman, Bill Adair, whose work remains a testimony to his skill.

I do not intend to sell it, and if my heirs decide to sell it, they will be instructed to tell prospective buyers it has been restored by Bill Adair.

[1563621]

Back in 2003 I had wanted a nice 1911 but I could not afford anything decent. I bought a 1917 model with essentially zero finish, but correct parts, from a well-respected collector who often has posted here. I sent it to Bill Adair who restored it. Bill was declining in health at the time and it took about a year for me to get the pistol. I compared his work with high resolution photos from a disc provided by another experienced collector and the grain of the finish and lettering were virtually indistinguishable. His workmanship was impeccable. He died not long after. It is my favorite Colt, although I have others with original finishes. Not only is it a fine example of a 1917 pistol, it reminds me of a skilled craftsman, Bill Adair, whose work remains a testimony to his skill.

I do not intend to sell it, and if my heirs decide to sell it, they will be instructed to tell prospective buyers it has been restored by Bill Adair.

If you have the orig. receipt, Save it with 1911. That will be a collector piece by itself.

[Johnny P]

There are some people that do beautiful restorations of blued 1911A1 pistols, and even to changing early phosphate finished 1911A1's to brushed blue, but I can't imagine these ever being highly desirable.