Reloads

[13Echo]

Leading in the Trapdoor occurs with using too small diameter bullet that does not fit the barrel and/or too hard an alloy that won't allow the bullet to "bump up" or conform to the barrel. If the bullet doesn't fit then gas blow by will cause cutting of the base of the bullet and deposit lead in the bore. If the bullet fits and has a decent lube you will not get leading to any significant degree at 1200fps or even more. This generally means in these rifles a soft alloy (typically 30:1 to 16:1 lead to tin) cast at 0.460 or more diameter with enough powder charge to cause the bullet to "bump up" and fill the bore.

Jerry Liles

[Dick Hosmer]

I'm surprised no one has brought up "barrel leading" with cast lead bullets. I would stay BELOW 1,000 fps to avoid leading. I use 20 gr of 2400 when using cast lead bullets.
1,562 fps is way to fast for a cast lead bullet.

While 1500+ might be a tad hot unless everything (bullet to bore size, lube, etc.) was spot on, you need to remember that issue ammo ran between 1150-1350 depending on the loading, this taken from data on the original packaging, so the "below 1000" comment seems incorrect. Have you measured your bore size, and what alloy are you using?

And, as to 1562 being "way too fast for a cast lead bullet", there are records of people being quite successful with (admittedly very hard, and with gas-checks) cast bullets in the .30-'06, up into the low 2000s, and that's in a 1-10" twist (the .45-70 is 1-22") so I do not believe that velocity alone is the issue, at all.

[carbineone1964]

I have some lead bullets that are 2/6/92 They seem to shoot pretty well in my Trapdoor. What the heck is that makeup? Is that a soft cast bullet? Hard? Maybe they are too hard? I think they are 2% tin 6% antimony and 92 % lead..

I do not want to be using something that may damage the barrel..

Thanks very much..

[Dale in Louisiana]

I have a couple of these old things. They're a hoot to load for and to shoot. I cast up my own bullets, naturally. The gun just begs for big soft-cast bullets.

Here's a great source for info: Loading Cartridges for Original 45-70 Springfield Most of the data in this book is oriented towards replicating the original black powder loads. The author recommends soft bullets. The original arsenal loads called out a 20:1 lead-tin alloy, with NO antimony. Part of the magic of the soft bullet and the black powder was that the pressure curve was fast and the 'kick' would expand the soft bullet to fill the grooves better.

Past that point, you can find loads for dozens of powders that will push a bullet out of a trapdoor safely and with accuracy.

Cast bullets from a couple of hundred grains to over five hundred will work, and velocities can range from a few hundred FPS to over eleven or twelve hundred. At the velocities you'd expect to push things out of a trapdoor, gas checks aren't needed. The limiting factor, safety-wise, is the fact that this old action should be limited to low-pressure loads.

The groove diameter of barrels can be greater than .460. Many factory lead bullets are .458, and that leads to leading problems.

dale in Louisiana

[coonhound]

I use 48 Gr. of Varget behind 500 Gr. Gov't bullet (Round Nose) and 1 gr. of cotton on top of powder. Works great and I can keep 1 to 1.5 inch groups from a rest

[coonhound]

Oops - correction. Make that thirty-eight (NOT 48!!!) Grains of Varget!!

[carbineone1964]

1 to 1.5 groups at what range? If that is 100 yards. That is pretty amazing shooting..

[John Sukey]

you fo;ls might want to keep in mind that there are two DIFFERENT loadings for the 45-70 round
One for the trapdoor, and one for the Winchester lever action

[Dale in Louisiana]

you fo;ls might want to keep in mind that there are two DIFFERENT loadings for the 45-70 round
One for the trapdoor, and one for the Winchester lever action

Make that THREE. Trapdoor and old rifles. Modern lever actions. Ruger #1's

You can load the daylights out of a Ruger and it will hold together. Don't ask me how I know, but God looks out for some of us.

dale in Louisiana