.223 IMR4064 load for AR gas system

Before anyone warns of the difficulties involved with loading long extruded granules of IMR4064 into a .223, please understand I have lots of 4064, and shorter extruded powders like Varget are still quite unavailable. I fully expect the loading to be "a pain."

Loading a 55 gr Dogtown soft nose bullet using IMR 4064 for a RRA LAR-15 with 20-inch barrel with 1:8 twist rate. My query: with these rifle particulars in mind, is 24.5 or 25 grains of powder the more appropriate?

As is usual, my thanks for any opinions.

You're going to have to load them and try them to see what works out of your rifle. My Sierra book for their 55gr bullets shows a starting load of 23.6gr and maxes at 25.8gr. I load a lot of 4064 for .30-06 and use a RCBS Chargemaster to measure powder. I haven't had much success using a powder thrower, I'll get weights +/- .5gr. Those granules are long but if you're using a good fitting powder funnel, you'll get them in there. Have you tried any of the new "ball" type powders like TAC or CFE223? Some of those are available from time to time. I've been using TAC and love it, meters like a dream and gives consistent results. I use a RRA National Match with a 20" 1:8 twist barrel.

Have not tried TAC as yet. Haven't come across it available. I know some round powders and shorter extruded powders make for easier, more consistant loading. It's just that I have 8 lbs of 4064 so why not use it. I currently use 4064 in .30-06, 6.5x55 and sometimes for .22-250. From what I have read, it is an appropriate powder for .223 loading, although admittedly not the best choice. My PRIMARY CONCERN is using it it a gas gun. My buddy and I usually load his .223 rounds with 26 gr of Varget, which is a slightly compressed load, with a 55 gr bullet and it is the bees knees for both his CZ bolt gun AND his AR. Cannot currently find Varget anywhere and the groundhog season around these parts is about to start up! Just don't want to experiment with anything too hot in the AR.

There's load data for it so I'd be comfortable using it in an AR. Direct impingement guns don't have the op rod issues like an M1. I know you varmint shooters can go through a bunch of ammo so that's why I suggested round powder. I haven't had much success getting consistent loads with 4064 out of a powder thrower so I measure each load. Takes some time. But if you have 8 lbs of it, I can understand using it.

If you use Varget in the .223 then 4064 will give you about the same performance as the two powers are almost identical. Varget not being temperature sensitive is the only difference between them. In fact you can use 4064 data for Varget. That is what the engineers at Hodgdon told me awhile ago.

Finished the last of 200 rnds last night. Have since found online AR-specific load references that have loads that mirror mine. I did trickle each and every round. I'm usually a little more lax - weighing only every 10 or so, but want to rule out any factors I can in this new (for me) load. I believe I read that Varget comes from Australia. Making a powder that is not temperature sensitive would make sense for a country that has so much desert (hot days with chilly nights). Might also explain Varget's absence from the local shelves...it's en route to us via rowboat.

I think it doesn't much matter where powder is made, the last "panic" has just completely emptied the supply chain. One advantage (I always have to look for the silver lining) is that you have to use what's available. I've found some new favorite powders in the process. One of my buddies used Hornady LeveRevolution in his AR at our last across the course match. He loves it. It runs about two spots slower than Varget and he got it for $125 for an 8lb. jug.

Just my experience, I have been using 24.9 g of IMR 4064 for 223 with a 55 g. fmj. It's my second choice (of the few powders I have on hand) behind Varget which meters better. Occasionally the 4064 will "bridge" in the case neck and spill if I don't give it a tap. No doubt there are better powders for 223, but it works OK if you don't mind the rare mess of spilled 4064 powder. I have 4064 on hand for 30.06, and try to have only a couple of rifle powders to keep things simple. But I found myself with not much Varget and 8 pounds of 4064 when reloading supplies were rare.

Dave