1866 2 band rifles

[lyman]

how uncommon or rare are these?

I picked up a collection last week and got 2 1866's,
one a standard 3 band, that had been nickeled, or chromed, not sure which, but it otherwise a nice rifle, despite the nickel

and a 2 band,

looking at Mr. Hosmer's book, it seems to be correct, (stock thin at wrist, likely from sanding, but nothing added as mentioned )
I'll try to get some pics up by this weekend,

it is worn, but not horribly so, and missing the cleaning rod,

wondering if this is something I should set in the corner and keep for a bit,


(Full disclosure, I am an FFL\SOT that likes old stuff)

[Dick Hosmer]

You do not want a thinned wrist - that is not SA work. Is the middle band in its' original location, or has its' spring slot been filled and a proper upper band fitted?

[lyman]

thanks,

I did not notice any woodwork around the spring slot,

I'll try to get some pics up by this weekend, if I have time

[Dick Hosmer]

Two-band 66's seem to come three basic ways:

(1) The properly-done (around 1100 in 1871) versions made by SA, referred to as the "Model 1866 rifle, Short". These were repaired 3-banders which had suffered muzzle damage. They will have set-back cleaning rods like the parent arm. They should not have a band-spring patch, and will have a properly located upper band.

(2) The ones that "look good" but are not. They will have the middle band removed (with a often near-invisible spring patch) and an upper band fitted, but not always exactly in the proper spot, resulting in some odd front end geometry. Cleaning rods can vary.

(3) The ugly ones with severely thinned wrists and the middle band left untouched, leaving a very long amount of wood out to the tip, and no "upper band" per se. Again the cleaning rod, if fitted, can be whatever.

The Model 1866 (aka 1867) Cadet is a totally different gun, miniaturized in all respects, shorter stock thinner all over, 1867-dated lock, etc.

[lyman]

here we go, switched to point and shoot and downloaded

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note, the band was installed by the previous owner upside down
fixed it after pics were taken


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[lyman]

more

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[lyman]

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[lyman]

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[lyman]

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[Dick Hosmer]

Thanks for posting the pictures. You have presented an example of my number (3). The work was not done at SA. If you are looking for an authentic SA 2-band '66, that one doesn't fill the bill, unfortunately.

While they certainly do not grow on every tree, no one would consider them rare. That one, however, does look honestly old, ands could be displayed as an example of a Bannerman conversion.

[lyman]

thanks for your eval,

much appreciated

[Kragrifle]

I have two of the two band 2nd Allins. Still looking for them, but I did come across my 1867 cadet. Looks to have the original stock. Even has the ESA cartouche and the script N behind the trigger guard.

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[Kragrifle]

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[Dick Hosmer]

As well as what I believe to be the correct rod (full length, shaft slightly smaller in diameter, proper SA head). I assume it screws in? Nice stock, much better than mine.

[Kragrifle]

Screws in. When I bought it years ago it came wrapped in an old wool blanket.

[Kragrifle]

Found the bayonet for the cadet.45246452474524845249