Any House Framers?

[Rifleman]

Building a new home, in town, lightweight construction type home. So they framed the 1st floor walls today and I found a lot of studs with these checks. I walked thru several other homes that are also under const and none had more than one or two like this in the whole house. I would say 20% of my studs are like this. So before I fly off the handle and chew butt I wanted a pros advise...should I be making them replace these?
42056

[S.A. Boggs]

Personally I would not accept these in my building, much less my house.
Sam

[leftyo]

oh hellll no!

[Allen]

I'm not sure the building inspector would accept them either. Remember it's your house and $, not the contractors.

[Rifleman]

4205742058

[Rifleman]

Yea, just wanted to make sure I not being over zealous as it's my house. I'll wait for their reply and if not acceptable I'll just call the building inspector. And to be fair, it was just framed, the building super has not seen it yet, he might have a cow himself.

[phil441]

I'll bet they got that wood at a really good price! Personally, I wouldn't settle for it. If they claim that it's not a load bearing wall, keep in mind that a wall also has to resist side forces, such as wind.

[JB White]

Those are beyond a little checking. Those are cracked. Maintain your cool but demand they come out.
Odds are if they replace a few they'll knock them out and pound the old nails over onto the sole plate before toenailing the new ones. I doubt they would take the time to sawzall the nails flush. If more than just a few are like that then demand they replace the entire wall unless your fine with your wall being toenailed.
It's your house and you're the boss. Photograph everything as it could be used as a deal breaker if you're so inclined.

[dryheat]

I've never seen anything like that. I'm not a builder, but I've watched friends put up homes. They sure as heck wouldn't accept that. What was the builder thinking? It looks awful.
Are you a cheap bastard? If you accepted the lowest bid well then....

[Major Tom]

Totally unacceptable! Those are weak lumber. May cause future problems for sure!

[ray55classic]

If this is what you can see, think about what they'll be hiding.
This shows beyond doubt they can't even spell craftsmen and will throw up anything IF they think they can get by with it.
You need to double check each & every single thing they do .
That crap needs to come down and I wouldn't settle for them toenailing the replacements in.
They screwed it up, make them fix it right or you can call your city or county building inspector, then they'll be fixing everybody's house.
These kind of yahoos will likely put 1 or 2 nails when common sense or code calls for 3 or 4
I'd also carry a 3 ft level and check each & every wall for plumb ,
use a measuring tape and check for square [measured diagonally both measurements should be the same or very close]
This is the skeleton of your home if it's not right , nothing will be right.
You're paying for this and will be for many years, If you accept crap work believe me you'll get it in spades.
Oh and BTW what is the primary language spoken by your so called "framers".?

[Sunray]

Stuff has been sitting inside somewhere. Dried out.
Isn't cracked either. It's split. You need to talk to the contractor and probably a lawyer.

[bdm]

Sir they were in the kiln to short or run through to fast i would not accept them if it were my house

[Dan Shapiro]

NO! NO! NO! Those are future problems waiting to happen!

[1563621]

I would call the Building Insp. if no action from foreman!

[Allen]

Let us know how things turn out.

[Sako]

The one picture shows to be an outside wall which would be a load bearing wall. The wood used is utility grade white wood which is the cheapest. Building code does not allow utility grade lumber on a load bearing wall. Like already stated, if replaced you will have toe nailed studs but that is better than shaky lumber.
The splits (shake) in the boards may be caused by one of two things - wind damaged trees or harvesting dead timber that has dried and split and that further devalues the lumber.
Link on wall construction.
http://www2.iccsafe.org/states/newjersey/nj_residential/pdfs/nj_res_chapter6.pdf

Selling shaky lumber makes shaky customers and shaky customers make shaky business and shaky business make everyone dissatisfied.

look up the building codes for your state.

[Allen]

The splits (shake) in the boards may be caused by one of two things - wind damaged trees or harvesting dead timber that has dried and split and that further devalues the lumber.

After one of our many hurricanes we lost 55 huge pecan trees. They were all laying on their sides with the roots and limbs still attached along with what looked like bomb craters where the trees had once stood. We contacted companies that buy/sell hardwood lumber. They said they weren't interested in buying them because they had been laid down by the wind stating that so many times they twist and splinter, crack, split the internal grain before coming down.

I have seen lumber graded as 3rd's that looked better than what I'm seeing on this photo of the wall.

[warbrds]

I have helped build a few homes, large decks, shops. Get that wood out of there, sub standard. Not what you want for your walls, trouble down the road

[ray55classic]

The one picture shows to be an outside wall which would be a load bearing wall. The wood used is utility grade white wood which is the cheapest. Building code does not allow utility grade lumber on a load bearing wall. Like already stated, if replaced you will have toe nailed studs but that is better than shaky lumber.
The splits (shake) in the boards may be caused by one of two things - wind damaged trees or harvesting dead timber that has dried and split and that further devalues the lumber.
Link on wall construction.
http://www2.iccsafe.org/states/newjersey/nj_residential/pdfs/nj_res_chapter6.pdf

Selling shaky lumber makes shaky customers and shaky customers make shaky business and shaky business make everyone dissatisfied.

look up the building codes for your state.

Sako is right about whitewood it's the cheapest crap available and to add insult to injury they're using seconds and thirds of the cheapest crap available.
Using it as framework for a home is highly unethical IMO
whitewood has little structural strength compared to yellow pine , even primed and painted whitewood usually rots out within a few years .
The only thing I've found it's good for is dunnage to keep the good lumber off the ground with.
His advice to look up your state & local building codes is sound . This will be valuable info for you to study and use as ammo.

If it was mine I'd be talking to a good lawyer & looking for a way to back out of any contract due to the contractor using substandard materials during construction.
Seriously don't accept this , any of it. Walk away now & you'll be ahead of the game

[PWC]

34years ago when we built our house i was there every day from the time they drovethe stake with the permit til final walk thru....when i saw a sub par / broken & repaired stud i took a picture of it then knocked it out. Once the contractor was there and said they were having trouble with vandalism and had to repair before they could go on. I told him it was me and he said i couldn't do that. I asked him if he wanted to go with me tomorrow to the home office and explain the pictures to to the builder and registrars of contractors. He sId no and i never had any more problems with the framing.

[dryheat]

The OP unfortunately has no experience in building but has at least the eye to spot studs that 99.7% of the population would be suspicious of. Not to be rude, but they must have seen you coming(it was the lowest bid wasn't it?). I can't imagine any builder trying to pass that stuff off. Now, if Mexicans are on the job that's another wrinkle. They are about as smart as rocks sometimes. I was having a tile floor installed in the kitchen. When the helper went to the store for more tile the Lot/Run No. was different. Didn't matter to him, he just kept on putting them down. All that had to be jacked out(more dust all over the house) and replaced.

[Sako]

Rifleman, I used a general contractor to build a house last year and man did I learn a lot! Building methods and materials have changed dramatically in the last 20 years. Waste of materials drove me nuts as did quality of work and it wasn't because the subcontractors couldn't do good quality of work they just looked to cut every corner they could get away with.
I had issues with the concrete, framing, nailing of the zip board, finish carpenters, plumbers and brick layers. I didn't win all of my arguments.

Another man that had a new house built down the road was diagnosed and treated for cancer after he stared building his house. The man said if he had to pick between having cancer and building another new house he would pick the cancer.

[PWC]

Not true, Dryheat.....One of the 3 largest builders, at that time, here in the valley

[Former Cav]

oh, you are in Phoenix. Everything they build out here is *hit!!
I had some moron going to do some remodeling and wanted to stick in studs that looked like a drill bit they were so twisted. I canned the guy.
He has either gone out of business or has changed the name of his outfit. Another B.S. Artist.

[S.A. Boggs]

Rifleman, I used a general contractor to build a house last year and man did I learn a lot! Building methods and materials have changed dramatically in the last 20 years. Waste of materials drove me nuts as did quality of work and it wasn't because the subcontractors couldn't do good quality of work they just looked to cut every corner they could get away with.
I had issues with the concrete, framing, nailing of the zip board, finish carpenters, plumbers and brick layers. I didn't win all of my arguments.

Another man that had a new house built down the road was diagnosed and treated for cancer after he stared building his house. The man said if he had to pick between having cancer and building another new house he would pick the cancer.
From someone who has just been down the cancer route what he stated is amazing...at least to me. Chemo is tough, being cooked from the inside out is tougher!!!
Sam

[Sako]

From someone who has just been down the cancer route what he stated is amazing...at least to me. Chemo is tough, being cooked from the inside out is tougher!!!
Sam
Sam, I am sure his statement was tongue in cheek and his wasn't as serious as what you have been through.

[Rifleman]

No actually This builder is normally awesome framing a house. I have walked thru every home they have framed in the last 6 months...and they welcomed it. I walked thru 3 houses today that where framed the same week as mine and they are excellent. My foreman is on his honeymoon so I really can't explain wth is going on but it is sureal. I called the bldg inspectors and they just blew me off. Everyone just thought I was making noise out of nothing and figured they would let kyle deal with me when he got back. Finally someone emailed me that those two board where bad and should never have been used...trying to appease me. I explained to him that in the 4 days he ignored me 34 more like it where used in the outside load bearing walls and the 2nd floor was now framed and in just as bad cond. Anyone know a good Attorney in Indy?

[Allen]

Shows you who the inspectors work for in your area. I would stop work on the house till your foreman decides to come back to work.

[Rifleman]

Exactly what I am thinking Allen. My wife and I have documented the heck out of it, literally every board in the house. I called the local news station attack dog, we'll see how that all goes tomorrow. I gave the builder a deadline of 14:00 TOMORROW or I talk to the media no turning back.

[JB White]

Foreman on vacation situation is BS. Somebody always takes over during a planned absence. Don't back down until after the problem is rectified as they're already blowing smoke up your... In other words don't back off based on a sincere sounding hollow promise.

[gwp]

Anyone know a good Attorney in Indy?

Barnes & Thornburg is a very large national law firm, with an office in Indianapolis, that also deals in construction law. They are very effective and seldom go to court, but when they do, they win.

http://www.btlaw.com/ConstructionLaw/

[Rifleman]

Finally some good news. The super of bldg emailed me yesterday and took responsibility and agreed that the framing was not right, that the crappy wood should never have been used and they would make it right. The solution is that I was able to mark each stud I felt was defective, they will then leave those, but will toenail a new stud to each side. I told them I wanted a stamped letter and new drawing from an Engineer and they agreed to do that. Today the lumber for the repair came in and I was able to inspect that before the work is done tomorrow.

[Oyaji]

Finally some good news. The super of bldg emailed me yesterday and took responsibility and agreed that the framing was not right, that the crappy wood should never have been used and they would make it right. The solution is that I was able to mark each stud I felt was defective, they will then leave those, but will toenail a new stud to each side. I told them I wanted a stamped letter and new drawing from an Engineer and they agreed to do that. Today the lumber for the repair came in and I was able to inspect that before the work is done tomorrow.

Doubt if your electrician and plumber will be happy with that "solution." Doubling and tripling up on the bad studs will just make it that much harder for them to run romex, cable, piping, etc.

[JB White]

Well, now you can tell everyone you have a "crippled" house. Crippling is the low-cost (but efficient) expedient.
Aside from sparky and the turd herder not appreciating it, your rockers and tapers are going to have seam problems if the studs aren't clamped flush as they go. I doubt a bungalow busting crew can afford the time to do that.

*added* While I didn't make my living as a bungalow buster, I did do a couple seasons of residential framing in my earlier years. For the most part I spent my years in the trade as a commercial carpenter. Hi-rises, hospitals, shopping malls, airport terminals etc. Metal framing can produce the same problems and results but for different reasons.

[Rifleman]

I was there yesterday and the Mexican labor was roofing next door, they all started yelling and I thought there must be quite the row going on. Went outside and found that some young man had fallen off the roof and was splat.

[dryheat]

Aye,yi yi.

[Oyaji]

¡Ay, caramba!

[lyman]

when we built my current house, either my brother or I would ride by daily to check progress etc,

anytime we saw something like that we notified the foreman,
if it was there the next day, we removed it ,