Unfired Remington 1903A3

[harrisd27]

So I listed this on Gunbroker after conferring with John Beard and getting an Approximate value... well needless to say the estimate was blown out of the Water!:1948:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=473257854

[Jeff L]

Nice.

[Tdarmo]

Hi
Nice rifle. Glad you did well with the auction. I was at my local gun store and they had a Remington that looks identical to the one you sold. I'm referring to the stock it looked like it never had any finish to it, very lite in color and clean. I will have to go back and get a better look.

[tmark]

What a unique find. I can only dream of having one like it.

[m1903rifle]

That's what you want...... 2 bidders in a bidding war.

[joem]

Doesn't get better than this!!!

[Emri]

That's what you want...... 2 bidders in a bidding war.

Amen !! I sold a pistol I didn't think would bring 2K and it sold for just over 4K.

[John Beard]

Since my judgment has been called into question, please permit me to defend myself.

I received an inquiry about the subject rifle by someone who identified himself as someone besides the seller. My reply to the inquirer was as follows:
________________________________

Thanks for your interest and inquiry!

My opinion is that someone will have to want the rifle real bad to justify paying that kind of money for it. And the rifle could not be re-sold to recover the investment anytime soon. And the fact that it has not sold yet is proof of that.

One can purchase a Remington M'03-A3 in that condition without box and papers for half that price. That would be a more attractive option to me, personally.

And, finally, when the rifle was in government stores before being boxed and sold, it was treated with a vapor deposition which left a microscopic layer of rust preventive on the rifle. The deposition leaves a slight chalky-looking appearance on the metal. The deposition must be applied to metal that is totally clean and dry and devoid of any oil. The seller has now handled the rifle and disturbed the rust-preventive treatment. A new owner will either have to clean and re-treat the rifle, or clean and oil it to prevent rust. Neither option is very attractive.

Hope this helps. Thanks again for your interest and inquiry. And Good Luck!

J.B.
__________________________________

The subject rifle was listed and re-listed five (5) times before meeting the alleged $2200 reserve. And in one listing, the rifle didn't even attract a single bid.

An analysis of the final bid history shows that only two bidders competed for the rifle. I have NEVER established value based on competition between two bidders. I usually establish value based on where the third or fourth bidder drop out of competition. Since three bidders never directly competed for the subject rifle, especially after five listings, I stand by my assertion that the rifle was overpriced.

This situation brings to mind a favorite saying of my father-in-law, "Two fools just met!" :eusa_shhh:

J.B. :hello:

[Rick the Librarian]

I agree with John - there was recently a M1903A4 sniper rifle that sold for $15,000+ - again, a matter of two people with deep pockets bidding against each other. Also again, not a way of telling the true worth of the rifle.

[wolley]

Well I'm not sure the price was too far out of line. Maybe $500?
I will surmise that if it had been listed on the CMP auction site that it would have sold for closer to $4K.
Not that CMP auction prices have any basis in reality.

[harrisd27]

John, I was the one who contacted you and YES I did over price the rifle on purpose to gauge what it was going to do. I was selling this on consignment and therefore try to get the most I can because he is a very old friend and if you READ my original post I said " THE ESTIMATE WAS BLOWN OUT OF THE WATER"... it received bids on the auction at the $1800.00 opening bid on all the auctions except ONE. as I was out of town for business a lot of the time this was listed and relisting automatically and I had very little interaction except answering a few questions.

Let me be clear that I was not EVER questioning ANYONE's Judgment especially yours John, I was simply posting this as a "WOW" holy crap moment! that I thought other members might find interesting.

I am also a collector and wouldn't invest in a rifle like this as I like to handle and shoot rifles in my collection even if it just a few times I was selling this for a friend and as far as Im concerned I don't care whether it was two bidders or ten I got the most for him that I could and he is very happy with the results as would EVERYONE of YOU had you listed it yourselves regardless of the opening bid which was $1800 and the reserve was $2200 and was based on getting the most for him. we discussed lowering the reserve because there were bids at $1800 and the reserve was not being met when the last auction exploded. So just so I am perfectly clear I NEVER said that the rifle was worth that nor implied that people should pay that or base this auction as a gauge in pricing theirs I simply took John's assessment of the pictures he looked at and gave me a approximate value and I priced it on getting the most for it. Frankly the owner of the gun bought a large collection (9 guns) and when averaged out he paid $300.00 per gun including this 03A3 so he had the time and the equity to sit and wait and adjust this auction as needed to get it sold. So honestly a $2425.00 profit on ONE gun in that bunch he bought was just fine with him. Had I known the Hackles that would have gotten raised by my posting this INFO only thread I wouldn't have bothered.

below is the email thread to John Beard and his ACTUAL response. so I think the $1800 opening bid (which was right in the middle of his appraisal) and the $2200 reserve which was INTENTIONALLY started high was right in the ballpark..



John Beard's Avatar

John Beard






John Beard is offline Senior Member


Join Date:Aug 2009Location:Sweet Home AlabamaPosts:1,642


Default Re: Two Rifles help Please




John,
I have sent these pictures to Rick the Librarian through Milsurps cause Culvers was down.
I am looking to get an Appraisel on these two rifles as I am going to be putting them up for Sale and want to ask the right amount.
First is a 1903A3 that appears unissued and still in the box it was shipped from Raritan arsenal in 1957. the only markings on the stocjk that isn't factory applied (I think) ids the S S on the bottom of the Buttstock inline with the buttplate. other than that it appears completely untouched since it left factory.

http://s277.photobucket.com/user/harrisd27/library/1903A3%20Remington

Second is a Inland M1 carbine same thing... still in the box from Red River army depot mailed in 1960 but still in original finish and also appears to be in unfired condition except for some handling/ rack rubs etc... it is an 11/44 dated gun and I compared this carbine to a friend here's locally(his also 11/44 Inland) and it is virtually IDENTICAL in every aspect. including the different shades of Parkerizing on the oprod and trigger group etc. his just is in used condition (like NRA 80-90%) and has lots of rounds through it...

http://s277.photobucket.com/user/harrisd27/library/Inland%20M1%20Carbine

I know finding something like this is getting VERY uncommon and finding them in this condition especially is even more uncommon and just want a realistic amount I could expect from selling these either on here to a collector or listing them on Gunbroker etc...

Unfortunately I cant keep them as I like to fire my guns and these are obviously a gun to keep exactly like these are now and a serious collector would enjoy these in their collection.

thanks for any help you can give me.

Dan

Thanks for your interest and inquiry!

I value your Remington M'03-A3 in the $1500 - $2000 range. A rifle like yours, less box, just sold today on Gunbroker for $1480. See item no. 462982865. An analysis of the bid history indicates that at least three bidders valued the rifle at $1400 or more.

I have no information on the value of your M1 carbine.

Hope this helps. Thanks again for your interest and inquiry!

J.B.

[John Beard]

Explanation accepted.

I can certainly fault no one for trying to get top dollar for their merchandise. I would do no less.

J.B.

[robh5]

I agree with John - there was recently a M1903A4 sniper rifle that sold for $15,000+ - again, a matter of two people with deep pockets bidding against each other. Also again, not a way of telling the true worth of the rifle.

I looked up the bidder history on that rifle. The 3rd highest bidder was out at 4k. Still cheap for that rifle, but closer to a realistic price then 15K.